Dale Johnson: Today on the podcast I have with me, Pastor Keith Christensen. I’m so grateful for this brother and his work at one of our training centers down in Fort Worth, Texas the Center for Biblical Counseling & Discipleship, a thriving training center down in that area. He is the preaching pastor of Christ Fellowship Bible Church, a recent church plant there in the Northwest Fort Worth area. Keith’s a certified ACBC counselor, he’s been involved in training biblical counselors since 2016. Keith and his wife have five children.
Keith, listen, I’m really glad to have you on today talking about the subject that maybe some people don’t think about a lot, but this issue of being idle. So, brother, thank you for being with us today.
Keith Christensen: Yeah, thanks for having me.
Dale Johnson: Now, I want to get into this and I want to make sure that our listeners understand because they’re seeing this, and we see this certainly in if you want to talk about manhood, particularly in the way it’s talked about today and idleness of people and it being a problem. You can see this in a lot of different areas, and sometimes you’re seeing it pop up in the counseling room, as I’m sure a lot of our counselors are.
I want you to first, let’s define what in the world are we talking about here with this issue of idleness?
Keith Christensen: Yeah, what I mean in the sense of needing to counsel idleness is the kind of thing that the apostle Paul was addressing in 2 Thessalonians 3, also in 1 Thessalonians, but 2 Thessalonians 3 is the longest sustained treatment of idleness in the Scriptures. And there Paul writes 2 Thessalonians 3:6 and following, “We command you, brothers, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that you keep away from any brother who is walking in idleness for you yourselves know how you ought to imitate us, because we were not idle when we were with you,” and here he defines what he’s talking about here in his example, “nor did we eat anyone’s bread without paying for it, but with toil and labor, we worked night and day that we might not be a burden to any of you for even when we were with you, we would give you this command: If anyone is not willing to work, let him not eat or hear that some among you walk in idleness, not busy at work, but busybodies. Now, such persons we command and encourage in the Lord Jesus Christ to do their work quietly and to earn their own living.”
So idleness in this biblical usage is just an aversion to toil, labor, and consistent work in a way that burdens other people. So, putting off responsibilities, avoiding them, or just doing work poorly. Richard Baxter, the English Puritan reminds us that idleness can be either duties omitted or duties sleepily performed. So, I think both of those things encompass what I mean by idleness. And if I could add one more clarification there, I think it’s important in 2 Thessalonians 3, Paul doesn’t say if a man does not work he shall not eat. He says if anyone is not willing to work. So, idleness is about an unwillingness to work, and that’s an important distinction because Paul says in 1st Thessalonians 5 that we need to admonish the idle, but he says, we need to help the weak and encourage the faint-hearted, and sometimes people are not doing a lot of stuff because they’re weak or faint-hearted and they need help and encouragement and not the admonishment that is especially appropriate for the idle.
Dale Johnson: Yeah, absolutely. And I think that distinction, that nuancing that you’re giving there is really important. Sometimes, we sort of grab along to one specific truth and we want to just forget some of the other teachings of Scripture, we have to mold those things together, just as you did at the very end there.
As we talked about idleness, I think this is really important for a lot of reasons. I think the first reason is we’re trying to recover biblical terminology in the problems that we see, and when we talk about, you know, this up-and-coming generation and men or women who are not doing the things that they’re called to do, but supposed to do, the man particularly in provision, or teenagers and being lazy and that sort of thing. God calls us here to address those issues and we need to call it for what it is, as opposed to it being labeled in some other format, like adult lessons, or something like that. We have to begin to return to a biblical description of these things, and I know some people might say, well, are we really having a podcast about this? I think this is an issue. This is something that we’re seeing that it’s growing, Paul certainly addresses it in Scripture. So, this is a part of our human nature human, sinful disposition, and that’s exactly what it is. I mean, this is a posture, this is a disposition, and we’re seeing it grow in our culture.
So, talk about why biblical counselors need to be equipped for this and some people might say, “Well, you know we might see this in a microcosm or some sort of small sliver, is this issue like really that bad?
Keith Christensen: Yeah, that’s a good point. Is this a serious issue? And it is, and it always has been. I think about the book of Proverbs. One of the dominant themes of the book of Proverbs is addressing diligent labor in the folly of the sluggard. How much does it talk about slothfulness? And the Proverbs illustrate for us. Yes, how devastating the consequences of slothfulness can be.
You think about Proverbs 24:30, where the writer says, “I passed by the field of a sluggard and it was all overgrown with thorns; the ground was covered with nettles, and its stone wall was broken down.” I mean there, there are devastating consequences that come from a life of idleness. And here, it can be an insidious kind of sin struggle, because it doesn’t seem that harmful in the moment, as the writer of the Proverbs reflects on what led to this just devastation of life. This overgrown field, broken down wall. He says, “I considered it, and I received instruction. A little sleep, a little slumber, a little folding of the hands to rest, and poverty will come upon you like a robber and want like an armed man.” Well, how bad is a little folding of the hands to rest, right? So, that’s the seduction of the sin of idleness, if you’re not doing anything idleness, am I really doing anything that bad by not doing anything? And actually Baxter again, his first direction for counseling the idle is before the first help against sloth is to be well acquainted with the greatness of the sin for no wonder it be committed by them that think it’s small. God himself, reckons it with heinous sins. We could add other Proverbs. Proverbs 18:9 “Whoever is slack in his work is a brother to him who destroys.” That’s strong language isn’t it, I mean, not just consequences for yourself, but for others. Well, I mean, I could heap up more, especially from the Proverbs. But, yeah, it is a very serious sin. I mean, think about how strongly those exhortations were in 2 Thessalonians 3 that we read earlier. And I guess I would also want to add that idleness is, and can be a breeding ground for other sins as well.
I could, if we had time, I could take you to various passages of Scripture, especially in the Proverbs, and make a case that idleness can be connected with other very common struggles and sins that are the dominant themes of our counseling ministries. Idleness can be part of what is feeding or resulting from anxiety, fear, covetousness, bitterness, depression, sexual immorality, pride, gossip, and other relational sins. Idleness can be part of the mix. No single sin ever stands alone, and so even if you’re not counseling idleness as the main presenting problem, it might be part of what you need to address to help someone walk in more freedom and obedience and Christ.
Dale Johnson: Yeah, I think that’s a great connection that you’re making. You’re helping us to understand it can, it can be a primary issue or it can be one that also is sort of a seedbed for other issues to grow. This is the level at which, we need to think Scripturally about these types of issues. And part of our blindness, if you will, toward these things is, that we have a tendency to be blinded towards that which is socially acceptable. And so, our consciences are not properly pricked, as Baxter would warned. And so, we don’t make it an issue that we’re fighting, as much as we may fight some other or what we view in our culture’s being a heinous sin. So, I think that’s an important thing. And historically what we’ve seen by the evil one, is that’s part of his scheme is to attack places where we would socially, you know, be blinded. So, I think that’s an important thing.
Now, you talked about several passages so far, but I want you to bring us into your counseling room, and as you’re dealing with people who struggle in this particular way, what are some of those go-to biblical texts that do a couple of things? First of all that help you to sort of build the framework, which you’ve talked about already, and then also that help you to encourage or to counsel the person who is idle.
Keith Christensen: Yeah, so as you mentioned, certainly I’d want to use some of the ones already mentioned, but I think another really important one is to use text that established the idea of sins of omission. James 4:17 “Whoever knows the right thing to do and fails to do it, for him it is sin.” So, it is sin, and therefore, will have negative consequences. Not only to do, speak, think, desire what is sinful, but is also sin not to do, speak, think, desire what is right. And that is a very helpful concept for counseling the idle because idleness or laziness by definition is just a life full of ongoing sins of omission. And again, Baxter, if I could quote him again, he says, “Idleness is not a single sin, but a continued course of sinning: an idle person is sinning all the while he is idle.” And if we understand the category of sins of omission, then we understand what he’s saying there.
1 Thessalonians 4, I think it’s helpful. That’s when Paul first starts to address the Thessalonians in this issue of idleness. 1st Thessalonians 4 beginning in verse 9, he actually addresses idleness, specifically in 4:11 and 12 “you need to live quietly, mind your own affairs, work with your hands, etc.” But that’s the continuation of a sentence where he’s talking about brotherly love in 1 Thessalonians 4:9, concerning brotherly love, “you have no need for anyone to write to you.” Verse 10, “we urge you to do this, excel in brotherly love more and more,” and then he says to “aspire to live quietly to work with your hands.” So, you’re dependent on no one. So, to excel in brotherly love requires repenting of idleness.
I think this is also helpful to show people that what you’re dealing with in idleness is a failure to love others, and in my own struggle against idleness has been very helpful. Often, I can negotiate with myself a little more folding of the hands to rest, but if I think who is being burdened by my choice to be idle right now? Who am I failing to love right now? How could I excel in brotherly love right now? And instead of placing burdens on others, how can I get up under the burden of others by working diligently right now? I think that’s helpful. And in Colossians 3: 22-24 is helpful that as kind of a put on that corresponds to the put off of idleness, and that says, “Whatever you do, work hardly for the Lord and not for men, knowing that from the Lord, you will receive the inheritance as your reward.” So, you don’t just want to put on work, you don’t just want to put off doing nothing, you want to put on wholehearted work for Christ, whatever you do.
Titus, I think Titus is a great book to use. If you remember in Titus Chapter 1, Paul says he’s writing to Titus who’s in Crete, and he says, people in Crete are lazy gluttons and then he says, “One of your own poets says this and they’re right.” And then he talks about how because of the grace of God that’s come that we can live self-controlled, upright, and godly lives because of what Christ did, and Christ redeemed us from lawlessness including the lawlessness of laziness to purify for himself a people who are zealous for good works. And Titus has that emphasis throughout, I think Titus is good especially to show how the gospel is up to the task, the work of Christ to turn lazy sinners into grace-driven people who are zealous for good works. Those are some that I would commend to counselors.
Dale Johnson: So, I want us to demonstrate procedurally how this works, right. So, we start with the Scriptures where we see the Scriptures describe some sort of problem. Now, we’re getting a good biblical view of the way the Scriptures teach about this in terms of things that we lack doing, or remedially how we come out of this, and what we should be pursuing, how we put off, and put on that sort of thing. And now, we want to take those passages and how do we apply them? How do we put them into practice in the counseling room? So, I want you to share if you can a few practical suggestions for counseling idleness. And again, we’re coming full circle. We start with passages of Scripture and from that flow how we would counsel. So, I think this is demonstrating methodology for us as well, so, help us here, Keith.
Keith Christensen: Sure, I’ll give just a couple of ideas to give you a start. Coming from the understanding that this is first and foremost, a sin against God, sins of omission. In addition to direct transgressions of Scriptures that talk about idleness and warned against it. Teach counselees to respond to idleness in repentance toward God, confess it with godly sorrow, ask for forgiveness, trust in the grace that God offers in Christ for forgiveness, and trust in the grace that God offers in Christ for power to change. Believe and talk to God in prayer about this, that because of the death and resurrection of Jesus, I am dead to the sin of laziness and alive to God to bear fruit for him.
And likewise, if laziness is a failure to love, teach them to repent towards, to seek forgiveness from those they have sinned against by their idleness probably, especially their family members, but maybe also co-workers, patterns of idleness that have brought negative consequences to others and burdened them. Teach them that they need to ask forgiveness from others for that. And that not only is just the right thing to do, but it reinforces this heart understanding that we were created to work for the sake of blessing others, that’s how we glorify God and image God in work, but it also reinforces that 1 Thessalonians 4 mindset that brotherly love requires working, diligent labor.
I think also specifically you heard some of the language in 2 Thessalonians 3 about those who were not busy at work but were busybodies and the same kind of thing. It’s interesting, you talked earlier about this idea of idleness, being a problem, especially vis-à-vis the teachings of what is biblical manhood, while in 1st Timothy 5, Paul says, I’m talking to younger women, I want younger widows to marry so that they don’t become idle and don’t become busybodies. So, men and women, I think you could kind of create a list of practical things you’re tempted to do to make yourself busy with instead of fulfilling the responsibilities that God has given you, and then consider how you might make no provision for the flesh in relation to that busybody list that you created of activities you run to, to run away from whatever responsibilities God has called you to fulfill.
You could also require people to make a schedule for themselves. An hourly schedule. Provide accountability for that. You could require people to make just a simple to-do list of daily responsibilities to prioritize those, not based on what’s easiest, but based on what really needs to be done most, and ask them to move through that list prayerfully in dependence on the grace of God. And provide very regular accountability for them. Those are a few at least starting places. Obviously, there could be more that was said.
Dale Johnson: That’s great, brother. This has been so helpful, and I think what’s going to happen is we all walked in the dark room together and all of us have been sort of blinded by maybe ways that we ourselves have been idle and you’re flipping on the light and you’re helping us to see according to Scripture. I encourage our counselors, the ones who are listening, to pay attention and to notice the way the Bible describes these problems. It is sufficient in helping us to see and diagnose, and then also giving us the beauty and the remedy of how we repair these things, which are part of our nature in all of us male or female, old or young, we can struggle with this particular issue.
Thank you brother for bringing this to our attention. It’s been great!
Helpful Resources:
The Biblical Solutions booklets series.
